Preamble

The House met at a Quarter before Three of the Clock, Mr. SPEAKER in the Chair.

PRIVATE BUSINESS.

Gillingham Corporation Bill,

Lords Amendments considered, and agreed to.

Carnegie Hero Fund Trust Bill [Lords],

Read the Third time, and passed, without Amendment.

London County Council (Money) Bill, Read a Second time, and committed.

Yorkshire (Woollen District) Transport Bill [Lords].(By Order),

Second Reading deferred until Thursday.

Oral Answers to Questions — INDIA.

BRITISH GOODS (BOYCOTT AND EXPORT).

Lieut.-Commander KENWORTHY: 1.
asked the Secretary of State for India whether he has any further information about the proposed agency for the purchase of stocks of British and other foreign cloths held in Bombay and elsewhere and its export out of India; and whether those selling their stocks to this agency are required to give an undertaking not to make further purchases of non-Indian goods?

Mr. DOUGLAS HACKING: 12.
asked the Secretary of State for India whether he has yet received a report from the Government of Bombay informing him of the total number of merchant houses in India which have given the undertaking to the agency company that they will not replace their stock by purchases of further cotton goods from Great Britain; whether he has also been notified of the total quantity of the stocks in question when the undertakings were given; and, if so, whether he will give the information to the House?

The SECRETARY of STATE for INDIA (Mr. Wedgwood Benn): I understand that at a meeting held on the 18th March it was decided to ascertain the extent of the stocks of foreign cloth in India. I have not heard of any further developments.

Lieut.-Commander KENWORTHY: I did not catch the answer, but might I ask, in regard to the last part of the question, whether this statement, which is so freely made in the newspapers of all parties, has been confirmed or not?

Mr. BENN: In answer to an earlier question, I gave particulars on that point.

Mr. HACKING: Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that it is two months since the agreement was signed, and cannot he get a definite report in connection with it?

Mr. BENN: If there is no information to give, I can give no information.

Mr. HACKING: Does that mean that there has been no action taken under this agency company?

Mr. BENN: I have given the right hon. Gentleman all the information that I have received on this matter. There is no other information.

Mr. HACKING: But surely—

HON. MEMBERS: Order!

Mr. SPEAKER: If the Minister has no information to give, how can he give it?

Mr. HACKING: There must be some information.

Mr. HAMMERSLEY: Might I ask—

Mr. SPEAKER: Mr. Freeman.

Mr. HACKING: 23.
asked the Secretary of State for India whether he is aware that the policy of Mr. Gandhi includes a determination that India must for ever banish foreign cloth, whether British or other, and that the first act of a popular Government in India must be the complete prohibition of foreign cloth; and whether, in view of the Irwin-Gandhi agreement, he will take further steps to safeguard the interests of the Lancashire cotton industry?

Mr. BENN: In answer to the first part of the question, the Government view was stated in paragraph 6 of the White Paper. The best method of treating this and other such matters in the new Constitution will, of course, be under consideration in the resumed discussions.

Mr. HACKING: Has the right hon. Gentleman read the article by Mr. Gandhi in last week's edition of "Young India," and does he not consider that a direct violation of the agreement?

Mr. BENN: The Government are concerned with their own policy, and I am prepared to receive questions and to give answers as to it.

HACKING: 39.
asked the Secretary to the Overseas Trade Department whether the agency scheme in India has yet reached a definite stage; and, if so, whether it is now possible to state its effect upon the cotton trade of Lancashire?

Mr. GILLETT (Secretary, Overseas Trade Department): Not so far as I am aware, Sir. The second part of the question therefore does not arise.

Mr. HACKING: Can I take it from the hon. Gentleman that this company has not yet had any influence with the merchants?

Mr. GILLETT: I am afraid I am not in a position to answer a question like that.

FEDERAL STRUCTURE COMMITTEE.

Mr. FREEMAN: 2.
asked the Secretary of State for India whether he can now state the names of the proposed Federal Structural Committee; the terms of reference, if any; and when it will be meeting?

Lieut. - Commander KENWORTHY: 5.
asked the Secretary of State for India whether he can now state the composition of the Federal Structure Committee of the resumed Round Table Conference; and whether the Anglo-Indian community is to be represented?

Mr. REMER: 17.
asked the Secretary of State for India if he can make any statement as to the setting up of the Federal Structure Relations Committee; and when it is expected that this committee will begin its labours in London?

Mr. BENN: I am not yet in a position to make a statement.

Mr. FREEMAN: Can my right hon. Friend give any indication when he will be able to make a statement on this matter?

Mr. BENN: Of course, the matter is one of constant and daily concern, but I can say nothing specific at the moment.

RIOTS, CAWNPORE.

Lieut. - Commander KENWORTHY: 3.
asked the Secretary of State for India whether there were any casualties to Europeans and the Government forces, respectively, during the Cawnpore riots; and, is so, whether he will give par-particulars?

Mr. BENN: Four non-official Europeans received minor injuries. Two deputy-collectors, one deputy-superintendent, and two sub-inspectors of police were injured, while several constables also received minor injuries.

Sir SAMUEL HOARE: Is it proposed to publish the report of the committee of inquiry, and, if so, when will the committee make its report on these massacres?

Mr. BENN: Perhaps the right hon. Gentleman has not noticed that there is a further question on that point.

Major-General Sir ALFRED KNOX: 10.
asked the Secretary of State for India if he can give the terms of reference of the commission of inquiry into the riots at Cawnpore; at what probable date the inquiry will be concluded; and whether he will then publish the evidence in full for the information of the House?

Mr. BENN: I gave the terms of reference on 16th April. I fear I cannot say when the inquiry, which is being held in public, will be complete.

Sir A. KNOX: Can the right hon. Gentleman answer the last part of my question?

Mr. BENN: It has been partly answered by my statement that the inquiry will be held in public. When it is complete, I will consider whether the evidence might usefully be printed.

Earl WINTERTON: In view of the fact that the right hon. Gentleman made an appeal to us on this side of the House, and to myself in particular, not to raise a debate on this question until the in-
quiry has been finished, will he accelerate in any way possible the finishing of the inquiry, so that this House may fully debate these deplorable circumstances?

Mr. BENN: Naturally, I should not do anything which would interfere with the full and exhaustive nature of the inquiry.

Earl WINTERTON: Will the right hon. Gentleman endeavour to point out to the Government of India the desire of the Opposition to have a day to discuss this matter?

Mr. BENN: It would not be appropriate to make such a representation to the Government of India.

Earl WINTERTON: 18.
asked the Secretary of State for India how many women and children were murdered in the Cawnpore riots; and in how many instances persons have been arrested who are alleged to have committed these murders?

Mr. BENN: I have no figures but understand that several women and children of both the Hindu and Moslem communities were murdered. Over 400 persons have been arrested, but I am not aware of the number, if any, charged with murder.

Earl WINTERTON: Will the right hon. Gentleman ascertain from the Government of India how many persons have been arrested in connection with these terrible murders and mutilations?

Mr. BENN: That information, with all the information that we can secure, will be given.

Mr. BRACKEN: 20 and 21.
asked the Secretary of State for India (1) whether any children of English parentage were murdered during the recent riots in Cawnpore;
(2) whether he can state the number of persons killed and injured during the recent riots in Cawnpore?

Mr. BENN: I have no figures of casualties later than those contained in the answer given on the 16th April. No European children were murdered.

ENFORCEMENT OF LAW.


            Brigadier - General Sir HENRY
            CR0FT
          : 4.
asked the Secretary of State for India whether having regard to the demonstrations in favour of assassina-
tions, and notably that in honour of the murderer of the late Mrs. Curtis, by the Central Sikh League at Amritsar on 10th April, he will instruct the Government of India to bring into operation the ordinary provisions of the Indian law regarding incitements to murder and attempts to promote hatred between different classes?

Sir A. KNOX: 14.
asked the Secretary of State for India if his attention has been directed to a speech made by Mr. S. G. Bose to the Sikh League at Amritsar, in which he said that India was required to produce thousands of Bhagat Singhs before she could attain purna swaraj; and whether it is proposed to prosecute Mr. Bose on the ground of incitement to murder?

Mr. BENN: The question of action in particular cases must rest with the Authorities in India who are fully alive to their responsibility for the enforcement of the law.

Sir A. KNOX: Can the right hon. Gentleman not urge on the Government of India and point out to them that these direct incitements to murder are particularly dangerous with an excitable population like that of India?

Mr. BENN: I have no doubt the Government of India are aware of the importance of the point.

Sir H. CROFT: Have no steps been taken to put the law into operation in regard to this case?

Mr. BENN: That question is covered by the answer which I have given.

Sir NAIRNE STEWART SANDEMAN: Has the right hon. Gentleman no influence on the Government of India to get action taken?

UNIVERSITY TRAINING CORPS.

Major GRAHAM POLE: 6.
asked the Secretary of State for India if he will give information concerning the progress that is being made in the creation and development of university training corps in India?

Mr. BENN: Eleven units in all have now been formed, of which I will circulate a list. The strength of the units at the beginning of the year was 13 officers and 532 other ranks out of an establishment of 26 officers and 710 other ranks.

Following is the list:

University Training Corps:

1st (Bombay) Battalion.
2nd (Calcutta) Battalion.
3rd (United Provinces) Battalion.
4th (Lahore) Battalion.
5th (Madras) Battalion.
6th (Burma) Battalion.
7th (Patna) Company.
9th (Delhi) Battalion.
10th (Nagpur) Battalion.
11th (Karachi) Company.
12th (Dacca) Company.

INDIAN ARMY (Aix ARM).

Major POLE: 7.
asked the Secretary of State for India the present position in regard to the proposed addition of an air arm to the Indian Army?

Mr. BENN: I am now working out the details of the scheme in consultation with my Noble Friend the Secretary of State for Air and the Government of India, and I hope it will not be long before the new Indian Air Force is definitely instituted. I should mention that it will be distinct from the Indian Army.

NORTH-WEST FRONTIER (TRIBAL CONTROL).

Major POLE: 8.
asked the Secretary of State for India whether the Committee under the Chairmanship of the Foreign Secretary to the Government of India appointed to inquire into matters connected with the existing system of tribal control and defence against risings on the North-West Frontier has now presented its report; and if it is the intention of the Government of India to make public the Committee's findings and recommendations?

Mr. BENN: The Committee has now submitted a report to the Government of India. Pending the consideration of it I am not in a position to say what the decision as regards publication will be.

PRISONERS.

Mr. FREEMAN: 9.
asked the Secretary of State for India how many of the 816 political prisoners still in gaol come under the conditions of the Delhi agreement for release; and when the remainder will be set free?

Mr. BENN: The number of persons convicted of offences in connection with the civil disobedience movement still in jail is 729, of whom 716 are not eligible
for amnesty. The cases of the remaining 13 and of five additional persons convicted since the amnesty for offences committed prior to it are under consideration.

DISTURBANCES (CASUALTIES).

Mr. CHARLES WILLIAMS: 11.
asked the Secretary of State for India if he will ask the Government of India to inquire from the local Governments concerned how many lives were lost and police killed, respectively, in disturbances of all kinds in the provinces of Madras and Bombay during the years 1925, 1926, 1927, 1928, 1929 and 1930 respectively; and how many lives were lost in similar circumstances during each of the same years in Calcutta?

Mr. BENN: Yes, Sir. I will ask the Government of India if this information can be supplied without the expenditure of undue labour.

Mr. WILLIAMS: When will the right hon. Gentleman let the House have these figures?

Mr. BENN: I really cannot say, but I do not propose to put pressure on the Government of India. The hon. Member is asking for figures for 1925 at a time when the Governments in the Provinces are fully occupied.

Mr. WILLIAMS: Then will the right hon. Gentleman let the House have the figures for the last three years, which cannot be very difficult to obtain?

CIVIL AVIATION.

Mr. DAY: 13.
asked the Secretary of State for India the amount of financial assistance given by the Government in India for the purpose of developing civil aviation in India for the 12 months ended to the last convenient date; and has he any particulars of the amount contributed towards the maintenance of light aeroplane clubs during the same period?

Mr. BENN: The total estimated expenditure of the Government of India on civil aviation and connected items during the financial year 1930–31 amounted to Rs.47,40,950 (approximately £355,570). This included a sum of Rs.2,59,700 (approximately £19,477) in respect of financial assistance to six light aeroplane clubs and to the Aero Club of India and Burma, Limited.

Mr. DAY: Can my right hon. Friend give any further information in regard to the Karachi-Delhi aeroplane service?

Mr. BENN: Perhaps my hon. Friend will make that the subject of a special question.

No-TAX MOVEMENT, GUJARAT.

Mr. REMER: 15.
asked the Secretary of State for India if the no-tax campaign at Gujarat is continuing; and how many persons have been arrested in the Bardoli region?

Mr. BENN: I have received no report since I replied to the question of the hon. Member for Moseley (Mr. Hannon) on the 16th April. As regards the second part of the question, I have no information.

OUTRAGE, UPPER CHINDWAN, BURMA.

Mr. REMER: 16.
asked the Secretary of State for India if any arrests have been made in the attempted murder of Captain Heaney, R.E., in Upper Chindwan, Burma; and if he can make any statement on the matter?

Mr. BENN: I have received no official report of this incident.

BURMA.

Captain PETER MACDONALD: 19.
asked the Secretary of State for India whether he has any further information to give the House regardin the recent trouble in Burma, particularly in regard to the adequacy of the protection afforded to British officials and citizens?

Mr. BENN: I am circulating a telegram received from the Government of Burma on Friday last. I have no doubt that the question of the safety of officials and the public generally has the constant attention of authorities.

Following is the telegram:
Only fresh news of importance is that rebels attacked the military police post at Yenatha in Thayetmyo District on 21st April and were repulsed with severe loss. Fifteen were killed, number of wounded unknown. Our casualties were three very slightly wounded. On 23rd
April, two platoons 2/15th Punjabis and some police mounted infantry came into contact with rebels at Inbe in Thayetmyo District and inflicted heavy defeat. Forty rebels killed: no casualties on our
side. It is hoped that effect of these two reverses will be very salutary, and local officers now are hopeful that they have Thayetmyo situation under control. Improvement reported in my last telegram in position in Tharrawaddy and Insein continues, and there have been rumours of threatened trouble in two other districts, but action has been taken and it is hoped that trouble will be averted.

MISSIONARY WORK.

Mr. D. G. SOMERVILLE: 22.
asked the Secretary of State for India whether, among the safeguards which will be insisted on by the British Government in any negotiations with the Indian Nationalists, there will be included the fullest possible protection for the freedom of missionary work in India?

Mr. BENN: This is an important matter which will doubtless be considered in the resumed discussions.

Mr. SOMERVILLE: Do I understand that definite protection will be insisted upon?

Mr. BENN: I can make no statement of Government policy at this juncture beyond what I have already said.

Commander OLIVER LOCKER-LAMPSON: Will the right hon. Gentleman see that missionaries and chaplains in the Army are protected?

Oral Answers to Questions — RUSSIA.

LABOUR CONDITIONS.

Mr. SMITHERS: 24.
asked the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs whether, in view of the statement in the Preamble to the Covenant of the League of Nations that the non-adoption by any nation of a humane labour régime is an obstacle to the efforts of other nations to improve the lot of workers and in view of the fact that Soviet representatives have been invited to attend the meeting at Geneva on 15th May of the European Committee of the League, he will make it a condition that His Majesty's representatives shall refuse to enter upon any discussions at such committee until the Soviet Government has agreed to allow an independent inquiry to be made by the League of Nations into the conditions of labour in Russia?

The SECRETARY of STATE for FOREIGN AFFAIRS (Mr. Arthur Henderson): The passage to which the hon. Member refers occurs in the Preamble to Part XIII—the Labour Section—of the Treaty of Versailles, and not in the Preamble to the Covenant of the League, as suggested by the hon. Member. It affects only the signatories of the Treaty of Versailles. I do not consider that it would be either useful or practicable to make a condition such as that suggested by the hon. Member in connection with the meeting to be held at Geneva.

Mr. SMITHERS: Why do the Government refuse to take any practical steps to improve the conditions of the workers in this country?

BOOKS (IMPORT RESTRICTIONS).

Sir KINGSLEY WOOD: 25.
asked the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs whether he has now decided to instruct His Majesty's Minister in Russia to approach the Russian Soviet Government with a view to obtaining permission for the entry into Russia of books printed and published in this country?

Mr. MARJORIBANKS: 34.
asked the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs whether he is yet able to make a statement as to whether the importation of the Bible into Soviet Russia is permitted; and, if not, whether he can state on what grounds?

Mr. A. HENDERSON: As stated by my hon. Friend in reply to the Noble Lord, the Member for Horsham and Worthing (Earl Winterton), on the 25th of March, books to which no exception is taken on political or economic grounds are admitted into the Soviet Union free of duty. I understand that in recent years the importation of Bibles into the Soviet Union has not been permitted, this prohibition being presumably based upon the proviso already mentioned. I am advised that the imposition of such a prohibition is a matter within the domestic jurisdiction of the Soviet Government, and, however much I may regret their attitude, the matter is not, in my opinion, one in which representations by His Majesty's Government would be calculated to secure the objects which the hon. Members have in view.

Sir K. WOOD: Surely the right hon. Gentleman will at any rate make some effort; surely he can have no objection to making some representations in the matter?

Mr. HENDERSON: I am afraid that I am not in a position to add anything to the answer that I have given. This matter, as the right hon. Gentleman knows, has been going on for years.

PROPAGANDA (INDIA).

Mr. SMITHERS: 28.
asked the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs whether his attention has been called to a leading article on India in the "Pravda," an official organ of the Soviet Government, on 3rd April, which contains instructions for the Communist party in India to commence a general strike, an agrarian revolution, and a general attack on the British Government; and whether he will make this article the subject of a protest to the Soviet Government as constituting a breach of the agreement reached with regard to non-interference in the internal affairs of the British Empire?

Mr. A. HENDERSON: I have seen the article referred to, but its contents are not accurately described by the hon. Member. It consists, in large measure, of an attack upon Mr. Gandhi, and of comments upon recent events in India. It contains no instructions to India Communists. The answer to the second part of the question is, therefore, in the negative.

FOREIGN TRADE (ORGANISATION).

Sir K. WOOD: 37.
asked the Secretary to the Overseas Trade Department whether he has now received the report on the organisation of the administrative machinery of foreign trade in the Soviet Union?

Mr. GILLETT: No, Sir, but the commercial counsellor at Moscow has again been reminded of the urgency of the matter, and has been instructed to state definitely when the report is likely to be completed

Oral Answers to Questions — TREATY OF DORPAT.

Sir K. WOOD: 26.
asked the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs whether any application has been made by Finland to
the League of Nations under the Treaty of Dorpat for the protection of Finnish nationals in Carelia and Ingria?

Mr. A. HENDERSON: As far as I am aware, no such application has yet been made.

Sir K. WOOD: Will the right hon. Gentleman make any inquiries?

Mr. HENDERSON: No, I do not think that this is a matter into which I should make inquiries.

Sir K. WOOD: Why does the right hon. Gentleman refuse to make any inquiries into this matter?

Oral Answers to Questions — MADEIRA (BRITISH SUBJECTS).

Captain P. MACDONALD: 27.
asked the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs whether communication is permitted by the Portuguese Government between British citizens in Madeira and this country?

Mr. A. HENDERSON: Communications by sea between Madeira and this country are difficult since the Portuguese Government have issued a decree closing the ports of Madeira to foreign shipping. Permission was, however, given to the Union Castle liner "Armadale Castle" to put in at Funchal on the 23rd of April, and to take off passengers and mails. I am informed that telegraphic messages are coming through fairly well, though with some delay, owing to the fact that they are censored both by the insurgents and by the Portuguese Government.

Oral Answers to Questions — CHINA (EXTRA-TERRITORIALITY).

Mr. GODFREY LOCKER-LAMPSON: 29.
asked the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs whether, in the negotiations now in progress regarding extraterritoriality in China, the report of the commission on extra-territoriality is being taken as the basis of the discussions?

Mr. WARDLAW-MILNE: 32 and 33.
asked the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs (1) whether he has received information from other foreign countries of their intention to negotiate with the Chinese Government regarding the abrogation of extra-territorial rights; if so, which Governments; and how far have such negotiations progressed; and
(2) whether Sir Miles Lampson's instructions covering his negotiations with the Chinese Government make it clear that no agreement regarding extra-territoriality will be concluded by Great Britain unless other nations enjoying similar privileges in China are in accord with the changes proposed?

Mr. A. HENDERSON: As I informed the hon. Member for Kidderminster (Mr. Wardlaw-Milne) on the 20th of April, and again on the 22nd of April, negotiations with the Chinese Government on extra-territoriality are still proceeding, but I am not prepared at the present time to make any further statement on the instructions which have been sent to Sir Miles Lampson. The report referred to by the right hon. Gentleman the Member for Wood Green (Mr. G. Locker-Lampson) has, of course, been fully considered by His Majesty's Government. Negotiations on the same subject are being carried on by the representatives of the United States, Japan and France, but I am not in a position to give details.

Mr. LOCKER-LAMPSON: Can the right hon. Gentleman postpone any definite decision about Shanghai until he has considered the report of Mr. Justice Feetham?

Mr. HENDERSON: I have seen the report of Mr. Justice Feetham, and his position will be kept in mind.

Mr. WARDLAW-MILNE: Is the right hon. Gentleman in a position to state that no decision upon the draft treaty will be come to until the views of the British Government are in accord with the views of other Governments with similar interests?

Mr. HENDERSON: I cannot definitely commit myself. I am prepared to take into consideration the views of other Governments, but not finally to commit myself.

Sir DENNIS HERBERT: Will the right hon. Gentleman be in a position to submit any treaty of this kind to the House before it is finally settled?

Mr. HENDERSON: I answered a question the other day in which I said that the proposal, if agreed upon, will be put into a treaty, which, in the usual way, will come up for ratification, and this House will have an opportunity of discussing the whole question.

Oral Answers to Questions — SUEZ CANAL.

Lieut.-Colonel Sir A. LAMBERT WARD: 30.
asked the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs how many official representatives and how many unofficial representatives the French Government has on the Suez Canal board of directors?

Mr. A. HENDERSON: There are no official, nor, so far as I am aware, any unofficial representatives of the French Government on the board of the Suez Canal Company.

Sir A. LAMBERT WARD: Is the House to understand that all the directors, other than those nominated by the British Government, are elected by the shareholders?

Mr. HENDERSON: That is another question. There are no members associated, as far as I can find out, with the French Government.

Oral Answers to Questions — EGYPT (BRITISH OFFICIALS).

Colonel HOWARD-BURY: 31.
asked the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs whether he can give a list of British officials, together with the appointments held by them, who have been given notice determining their appointments with the Egyptian Government, or who have retired voluntarily during the last year from April, 1930–31; and whether he will make representations urging that when these vacancies are not filled by Egyptians they should be replaced by British officials?

Mr. A. HENDERSON: Forty-five British officials, mostly holding technical posts, received notice terminating their appointments under the Egyptian Government, or resigned voluntarily, during the calendar year 1930. Time has not permitted me to obtain the figures for the period April, 1930–1931. Nine of these officials have been or are being replaced by other Englishmen, and the remaining thirty-six posts have either been suppressed or filled by Egyptians. Twenty-four British officials entered the service of the Egyptian Government during 1930. No case has been brought to my notice of a British official being replaced by another foreigner.

Mr. SPEAKER: Mr. Hore-Belisha.

Mr. MILLS: In view of the fact that the Parliamentary system—

Mr. SPEAKER: I have already called upon the hon. Member for Devonport (Mr. Hore-Belisha).

Oral Answers to Questions — PORTUGUESE WEST AFRICA (BRITISH SEAMAN'S ARREST).

Mr. HORE-BELISHA: 35.
asked the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs if he can now state what decision the Portuguese Government have reached as a result of the representations made by His Majesty's Ambassador at Lisbon in November, 1928, regarding the arrest on the charge of theft of £1 by Mr. A. J. Brewer, who was detained for nine months while awaiting trial in Portuguese West Africa and subsequently sentenced to 300 days' imprisonment and £18 fine or another 90 days' imprisonment?

Mr. A. HENDERSON: I am happy to be able to inform the House that the Supreme Court of Portugal has decided in favour of the revision of the trial of Mr. A. J. Brewer. Further developments are awaited, and I trust that the untiring efforts of His Majesty's Ambassador in Lisbon on Mr. Brewer's behalf will eventually lead to a satisfactory result.

Mr. HORE-BELISHA: Is the right hon. Gentleman aware how much the persistency with which he has tried to vindicate the rights of British citizenship will be appreciated?

Oral Answers to Questions — NAVAL AND MILITARY PENSIONS AND GRANTS.

Mr. DAY: 36.
asked the Minister of Pensions whether he has any statistics that will show the number of cases during the previous 12 months in which further awards have been made to pensioners on the ground that final awards should not have been made in the first place; and will he give particulars?

The MINISTER of PENSIONS(Mr. F. 0. Roberts): The answer to the first part of the question is in the affirmative, and the number of cases so dealt with in the 12 months ended 31st March, 1931, was 2,715.

Mr. DAY: Has the right hon. Gentleman precise statistics of the whole number of cases?

Mr. ROBERTS: I should like to have notice of that question.

Oral Answers to Questions — TRADE AND COMMERCE.

RUSSIA.

Mr. de ROTHSCHILD: 38.
asked the Secretary to the Overseas Trade Department whether he will set up a clearing house to handle all Russian purchases and sales transactions, in order to put an end to the system whereby the money paid by this country for goods purchased in Russia is used to finance Russian purchases from the United States of America and from other countries whose exports to Russia exceed their imports?

Mr. GILLETT: While His Majesty's Government are anxious in every way to promote the export trade of this country to the Soviet Union, as to other destinations, and have considered on several occasions suggestions for setting up a clearing house on lines analogous to those proposed by the Hon. Member, they have found them to be administratively impracticable.

Sir A. KNOX: 41.
asked the Secretary to the Overseas Trade Department what is the total face value and the Government's total liability under the Export Credits Scheme for all contracts concluded by his Department for exports to Russia during the present Parliament; and what is the total face value and the Government's total liability under the same schemes for exports to all other countries during the same period?

Mr. GILLETT: From 10th June, 1929, to the 18th April, 1931, the Export Credits Guarantee Department entered into contracts covering credits for £6,666,926 in respect of exports to Russia and £6,991,625 in respect of exports to all other countries. The total liability undertaken on these contracts was £4,016,923 and £4,397,244, respectively.

Sir A. KNOX: Can the hon. Gentleman say why this extraordinary preference should be given to Russia over all other countries and over our Dominions?

Mr. GILLETT: I would remind the hon. and gallant Member that these transactions are carried through on the recommendation of the Advisory Committee.

Mr. R. A. TAYLOR: Is it not a fact that no losses have been incurred on these transactions?

Mr. GILLETT: This is a fact.

SOUTH AFRICA (TRADE COMMISSIONERS).

Major GLYN: 42.
asked the Secretary to the Overseas Trade Department whether he is yet able to announce any decision with regard to the appointment of a new trade commissioner post for Northern Rhodesia, Southern Rhodesia, and Nyasaland, with headquarters at Salisbury, and an additional trade commissioner for the Union of South Africa, to encourage the sale of British goods and manufactures in those countries, as recommended in the report of the United Kingdom Trade Mission to the Union of South Africa, Southern Rhodesia, and Northern Rhodesia?

Mr. GILLETT: I regret that I am at present unable to add anything to my reply on this subject to a question asked by the hon. Member for Birkenhead, East (Mr. White) on Monday, 9th February. I am sending the hon. and gallant Member a copy.

Mr. GRAHAM WHITE: Can the hon. Gentleman say whether the export traders themselves are taking action to establish representatives there?

Mr. GILLETT: I am afraid I have no information on that point.

OVERSEAS TRADE (PROPAGANDA).

Mr. WHITE: 43.
asked the Secretary to the Overseas Trade Department if it is his intention to initiate a scheme of national trade propaganda overseas, on the lines of the Empire Marketing Board?

Mr. GILLETT: There are no funds at my disposal which would enable me to initiate a scheme of the kind suggested. A small interdepartmental committee is, however, examining the means for co-ordinating the activities of the various Departments interested in this question within the limits of their available resources.

Mr. MILLS: Have not the Empire Marketing Board, according to their title, the power to advertise in the Dominions as well as in this country?

Mr. GILLETT: I think that is so.

Mr. MILLS: Have any steps been taken to make that propaganda effective in other countries?

Mr. GILLETT: A question should be put down on that subject.

BRAZIL (BRITISH TEXTILE GOODS).

Captain P. MACDONALD: 65.
asked the President of the Board of Trade whether he has any information as to recent increases in the rate of duty on textiles entering Brazil; and what steps have been taken to secure some mitigation of the duties on British goods?

Mr. GILLETT: As the answer is rather long I will, with the hon. and gallant Member's permission, circulate it in the OFFICIAL REPORT.

Following is the answer:

Information as to recent Brazilian decrees increasing the duties on jute, jute yarns, cotton yarns, wool yarns, wool piece goods and various other classes of goods, based on telegraphic information received from His Majesty s Embassy at Rio de Janeiro, published in the "Board of Trade Journal' for the 23rd April, of which I am sending the hon. and gallant Member a copy. The new duties on wool goods are not yet in force. The duties on jute, jute yarns and cotton yarns, although higher than those previously in force, are, I am glad to say, substantially lower than those originally proposed in the Brazilian decree of December last, in regard to which, as the Noble Lady the Member for Kinross and West Perth was informed on the 2nd February last, representations were made to the Brazilian Government by His Majesty's representative at Rio de Janeiro.

Oral Answers to Questions — AGRICULTURE.

ISLE OF ELY (AGRICULTURAL ORGANISER).

Mr. de ROTHSCHILD: 44.
asked the Minister of Agriculture whether he will take immediate steps to urge the appointment of an agricultural organiser by the Isle of Ely County Council in order to secure that the results of scientific investigations at the agricultural research stations should be passed on to the Isle of Ely farmers and that the Isle of Ely may be no longer one of the few counties which derive no benefit from the setting up of these Government organisers?

The MINISTER of AGRICULTURE (Dr. Addison): ; The county council are well aware of my desire that they should appoint an agricultural organiser; my views on this subject were conveyed to the education committee as recently as
last October. I do not think, therefore, that any useful purpose would be served by further representations to the local authority at present.

INTERNATIONAL WHEAT CONFERENCE.

Mr. de ROTHSCHILD: 46.
asked the Minister of Agriculture whether it is proposed to publish the report of the Rome Wheat Conference; whether the question of imports boards was discussed by this conference; whether the subject was introduced by British delegates; and what attitude was adopted towards it by the conference?

Dr. ADDISON: As the answer is rather long, I propose, with the hon. Member's permission, to circulate it in the OFFICIAL REPORT.

Following is the answer.

As regards the first part of the question, I would refer the hon. Member to the reply I gave to a question put by my hon. Friend the Member for Govan (Mr. Maclean) on the 16th April last.

The subject of import organisations was not introduced into the discussions of the Preparatory Wheat Conference until a very late stage in the proceedings, when a draft resolution to the following effect was submitted to the Committee on Production and Trade by the Chairman:
At the same time the conference urgently recommends importing countries to endeavour to organise and concentrate the purchase of imported wheats. This should be carried out in the form most suited to the particular circumstances obtaining in each country; its essential object should be the creation of import organisations capable of negotiating, through an international organisation, with the export organisations.

Having regard to the fact that the subject had not been discussed by the committee, and because the terms of the draft resolution were too categorical, the resolution on the subject, which was finally adopted by the Plenary Conference, was as follows:
At the same time the Conference recommends purchasers in importing countries, where the need is felt, to endeavour to organise the purchase of imported wheats. This can he carried out whatever form it takes, according to the particular situation in each country.

SMALLHOLDINGS.

Mr. C. WILLIAMS: 47.
asked the Minister of Agriculture whether there
has been any increase in the number of applications for smallholdings during the present year?

Dr. ADDISON: I am unable to say whether there has been any increase this year in the number of applications made to county councils and councils of county boroughs as the last available returns are for 1930. My Department has received since the beginning of this year over 4,000 applications and inquiries with regard to smallholdings proposed under the Agricultural Land (Utilisation) Bill.

SOFT FRUIT PRICES.

Sir BASIL PETO: 48.
asked the Minister of Agriculture whether his attention has been called to the average prices obtained for British-grown raspberries, black currants, and red currants used in jam making last year, £22 17s., £18 10s., and £16 10s., respectively, per ton, and to the fact that these prices are only about one-fifth of the prices current in 1928; and whether he has made, or proposes to make, any inquiry as to the effect of these low prices on employment in fruit-producing areas?

Dr. ADDISON: I am aware of the low prices ruling for soft fruits last season. The chief item of cost in the case of soft fruit is for picking, which is generally performed by seasonal labour. The prices ruling last season have not, therefore, so far as I am aware, had any substantial effect on reducing the number of men regularly employed in the chief soft fruit areas. The result of the Agricultural Returns which will be collected on 4th June next will, however, provide information as to the number of workers employed and the acreage under the various crops on that date as compared with the previous year.

Sir B. PETO: Does the right hon. Gentleman not realise how greatly the demand for fruit-picking labour is diminished if fruit has to be left on the trees or bushes because it is not worth the cost of picking?

Dr. ADDISON: If the hon. Member will assist me to get through the Marketing Bill, it will help the position.

Sir B. PETO: Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that I am not a member of the Committee considering the Bill?

BUTTER (IMPORTS).

Sir WILLIAM WAYLAND: 49.
asked the Minister of Agriculture whether he is aware that 600,000 boxes of Russian butter are estimated to arrive in this country during the coming season; whether there is reason to anticipate increased butter imports from other Continental sources; and whether he proposes to continue and extend the work recently carried out in the North of England with a view to encouraging retailers to stock Home and Empire butter in preference to foreign butter?

The SECRETARY of STATE for DOMINION AFFAIRS (Mr. J. H. Thomas): I have been asked to reply. As regards the first and second parts of the question, my right hon. Friend the President of the Board of Trade informs me that he has no official information as to future imports of butter from Russian and other Continental sources. As regards the third part of the question, the canvass of retailers in the North, which is directed to encouraging the sale of Empire butter from Home and overseas, is still in progress and the question of its possible extension is at present under consideration by the Empire Marketing Board. I should add that it has so far proved very successful.

Sir W. WAYLAND: May I ask the right hon. Gentleman to keep his weather eye on the situation, which, from the point of view of home and Empire butter, is very critical?

Mr. THOMAS: I have got both eyes on it.

Lieut.-Commander KENWORTHY: Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that far heavier imports of butter came from Russia before the War?

Mr. THOMAS: I could not say anything about that.

Oral Answers to Questions — LAW OFFICERS (SALARIES AND FEES).

Mr. D. G. SOMERVILLE: 45.
asked the Prime Minister if he will consider, in the interests of public economy, fixing the remuneration of his legal advisers on the scale applicable to ordinary Ministers of the Crown?

The PRIME MINISTER (Mr. Ramsay MacDonald): The hon. Member will remember that this question was carefully considered by the Select Committees on Ministers' Remuneration which reported in 1920 and 1930. The former suggested a slight reduction, but the Government of the time took no action, and the latter made no recommendation. I understand, however, that before the end of the last financial year the Law Officers themselves made a proposal to the Chancellor of the Exchequer for a reduction of their emoluments, and that this proposal is under consideration.

Mr. SOMERVILLE: In view of the fact that the Attorney-General received more than £39,000 over a period of 21 months, should not something be done in the matter, especially in view of the unemployment existing to-day?

The PRIME MINISTER: I think it is most unjust that a practice which has been carried on by both sides and in all Governments should now, by implication, be put down to some defect on the part of the present Attorney-General.

Sir K. WOOD: Does not the right hon. Gentleman think he has some special responsibility to bring these salaries more in keeping with Socialist doctrines?

The PRIME MINISTER: That is so, and I have always recognised it, but at the same time I have had to recognise the past practice, and, more particularly, the evidence given by Lord Hailsham on this subject.

Mr. HORE-BELISHA: Does the right hon. Gentleman intend to put into operation the formula enunciated by the Attorney-General of working for use and not for profit?

The PRIME MINISTER: No Attorney-General has ever put into practice the first part of that statement more effectively than the present one.

Oral Answers to Questions — POST OFFICE.

MANIPULATIVE STAFF (WAGES).

Mr. BOWEN: 50.
asked the Postmaster-General if he will state the number of full-time female manipulative officers of 21 years or over at present receiving inclusive pay below 40s. a week, between
40s. and 50s., between 50s. and 60s., and over 60s.; and the numbers in each of these groups in London and the Provinces, respectively?

The POSTMASTER - GENERAL (Mr. Attlee): As the answer contains a number of figures I will, with my hon. Friend's permission, circulate it in the OFFICIAL REPORT.

Following is the answer:

The desired information is approximately as follows:

Below 40s.—London, 250; Provinces, 750.
Between 40s. and 50s.—London, 2.800; Provinces, 5,000.
Between 50s. and 60s.—London, 2,500; Provinces, 5,400.
Over 60s.—London, 1,400; Provinces, 1,200.

Mr. BOWEN: 52.
asked the Postmaster-General if he will state the number of full-time male manipulative officers of 21 years or over at present receiving inclusive pay below 40s. a week, between 40s. and 50s., between 50s. and 60s., between 60s. and 70s., and 70s. or over, and the numbers in each of these groups in London and the provinces, respectively?

Mr. ATTLEE: As the answer contains a number of figures I will, with my hon. Friend's permission, circulate it in the OFFICIAL REPORT.

Following is the answer:

The desired information is approximately as follows:

Below 40s. a week—London, nil; Provinces, 1,400.
Between 40s. and 50s.—London, 2,900; Provinces, 8,700.
Between 50s. and 60s.—London, 3,800; Provinces, 25,500.
Between 60s. and 70s.—London, 12,000; Provinces, 10,000.
70s. or over—London, 8,500; Provinces, 11,400.

TELEPHONE BOXES (CAB RANKS).

Mr. BOWEN: 51.
asked the Postmaster-General whether he will state the number of telephone boxes placed on taximeter-cab ranks in London since 1st January last, and the estimated number to be erected during the months of April and May?

Mr. ATTLEE: Between the 1st January and the 31st March, telephone facilities were provided at two cab ranks in London. The provision of telephones at five further cab ranks is in hand.

ELMBRIDGE TELEPHONE EXCHANGE.

Sir GEORGE PENNY: 53.
asked the Postmaster-General what progress is being made with the new Elmbridge telephone exchange; and when subscribers will in fact be transferred to it?

Mr. ATTLEE: Unexpected difficulties have been experienced with the foundations, and I regret that I am thus unable to offer hopes of an improvement on the programme given in reply to the hon. Member's question of 25th November last.

TELEPHONE INSTRUMENTS.

Major CHURCH: 54.
asked the Postmaster-General if orders are still being placed by his Department for the supply of the old-type telephone instrument; what orders he has placed for the new-type instrument; how the cost of the new type compares with that of the old; and if he will give an estimate of the relative costs of maintenance in service of the old and the new type?

Mr. ATTLEE: There is no present necessity for placing orders for the pedestal type of instrument. Large orders for the new type have been and are being placed, but I do not think it right to make public the precise magnitude of the contracts. As I informed the hon. and gallant Member in reply to his question on the 20th instant, the new type is more expensive in initial cost, but I am unable to disclose contract prices, which must necessarily be regarded as confidential. It is estimated that the, maintenance costs of the new hand-microphone will be about 20 per cent. higher than those of the pedestal instrument.

Oral Answers to Questions — GOVERNMENT DEPARTMENTS (COAL PURCHASES).

Mr. SIMMONS: 55.
asked the First Commissioner of Works if he will state the price paid per ton for the coal purchased from Warwickshire and Yorkshire collieries and delivered to his Department for the use of Government offices in London, and the total quantities purchased from these sources during the
year 1930; and whether he can give details showing the pit-head price, railway rates, wagon hire, depot, and other charges included in the total cost for coal supplied from the areas named?

The FIRST COMMISSIONER of WORKS (Mr. Lansbury): The average price for domestic coal supplies purchased direct from collieries and delivered in London Government Offices is approximately 32s. per ton. This figure includes railway rates and wagon hire, loading and delivery charges and overhead expenses, borne direct by the Department. The quantity of coal so purchased during 1930 was approximately 20,000 tons.

Mr. SIMMONS: 56.
asked the First Commissioner of Works if he will state the price paid, per ton, for coal supplied to his Department for Government local use from local collieries in the towns of Stafford and Sheffield, with the details of how the total price is made up; and what is the price paid for direct supplies of coal to his Department in Nuneaton from the local collieries, with details of how the total price is made up?

Mr. LANSBURY: The average price for coal delivered into cellars in Staffordshire, Yorkshire and Warwickshire is approximately 22s. per ton.

Oral Answers to Questions — HOUSE OF COMMONS (TERRACE AWNINGS).

Mr. VAUGHAN: 57.
asked the First Commissioner of Works whether he will consider the provision of suitably-coloured awnings over a portion of the terrace during the coming summer in order to avoid inconvenience to Members, visitors and staff by rain showers while taking refreshments?

Mr. LANSBURY: I would refer my hon. Friend to the reply I gave to a similar question by my hon. Friend the Member for Southwark Central (Mr. Day) on the 21st July last, a copy of which I am sending him?

Mr. FRANK OWEN: Can we also have some comfortable beds and couches for Members of His Majesty's Government?

Oral Answers to Questions — NATIONAL HEALTH INSURANCE FUNDS.

Mr. GRACE: 60.
asked the Minister of Health whether he will give the figures of the accumulated funds of approved
societies for the last three available years, and the respective amounts which have been invested by or on behalf of approved societies for those years?

The PARLIAMENTARY SECRETARY to the MINISTRY of HEALTH (Miss Lawrence): The accumulated funds of approved societies in Great Britain amounted to:—

£115¼ millions at 31st December, 1928.
£113 millions at 31st December, 1929.
£114 millions at 31st December, 1930.

The amounts invested by or on behalf of approved societies have been:—

£1 million for 1928.
£1 million for 1930.

For 1929 investments were realised to the amount of 22¼ millions.

Oral Answers to Questions — ROYAL NAVY.

CORDITE FACTORY, HOLTON HEATH (RETIRING AGE).

Major LLEWELLIN: 62.
asked the First Lord of the Admiralty whether he is aware that men employed in the Royal Naval Cordite Factory at Holton Heath who are retired at 60 without pensions have difficulty in obtaining other employment pending the age at which they are entitled to old age pensions; and whether he will consider extending the retiring age to 65 for those still capable of performing the work?

The PARLIAMENTARY SECRETARY to the ADMIRALTY (Mr. Ammon): The regulation for Admiralty industrial establishments is that all such persons are as a rule to be pensioned or discharged on attaining 60 years of age but they may be retained until 65 if recommended annually for retention and subject to physical fitness. No sufficient reason is seen for making an exception in favour of employés at the Royal Naval Cordite Factory.

HIS MAJESTY'S SHIP "QUEEN ELIZABETH" (FOREIGN SERVICE LEAVE).

Mr. HORE-BELISHA: 63.
asked the First Lord of the Admiralty whether arrangements are being made to give naval ratings, a considerable number of whom are married men, who are about to complete their two and a-half years' foreign service in His Majesty's Ship
"Queen Elizabeth," Mediterranean Fleet, the foreign service leave to which they are entitled?

Mr. AMMON: In accordance with the Regulations arrangements are invariably made to relieve ratings as soon as practicable after completion of two and a-half years' foreign service, and in any case before the expiration of three years abroad. Foreign service leave follows automatically on return to the home depot.

Oral Answers to Questions — COAL INDUSTRY.

CHURCH ESTATES, DURHAM (ROYALTIES).

Mr. LAWTHER: 64.
asked the hon. Member for Central Leeds, as representing the Ecclesiastical Commissioners, if he will seek to have the present royalty rents on coal that are drawn in Durham county by the Ecclesiastical Commissioners withdrawn during the present period, in view of the fact that the mine workers are being asked to suffer reductions in wages, and that the sum paid in the said royalty rents would help materially to avoid any such contemplated reduction?

Mr. DENMAN (Second Church Estates Commissioner): The Ecclesiastical Commissioners hold their property under Statutes which impose upon them obligations to use the revenues for certain defined purposes. It is not in their power to deal with their mineral rents in the manner suggested.

Mr. LAWTHER: Is it not a fact that the Ecclesiastical Commissioners have funds to the extent of £61,000,000, and in those circumstances will the hon. Member not consider giving up for one year a mere £200,000?

Mr. DENMAN: The Ecclesiastical Commissioners cannot go beyond their statutory obligations.

Sir D. HERBERT: Is it not a fact that the major part of the surplus of the Ecclesiastical Commissioners goes to provide better salaries for the poorest paid class in the country?

Mr. HARDIE: Is it not within the province of the Ecclesiastical Commissioners to apply for powers to do what is requested by the question?

Major COLFOX: Does not the responsibility which rests upon the owners of royalties rest also upon the Ecclesiastical Commissioners?

Mr. HARDIE: May we have an answer to the question?

Mr. DENMAN: I do not think the Ecclesiastical Commissioners are entitled to ask for Parliamentary time at present.

EXPORT PRICES.

Mr. HERRIOTTS: 68.
asked the Secretary for Mines what was the average selling price of coal exports for the years 1929 and 1930, respectively, and also the export price for the quarter ended 31st March, 1931?

The SECRETARY for MINES (Mr. Shinwell): The average declared value f.o.b. of all coal exported during 1929 was 16s. 2d., and during 1930 16s. 8d. Comparison with the quarter ended 31st March, 1931, is affected by the dispute in January, in South Wales, resulting in the export of a smaller proportion of the higher-priced anthracite and steam coal, but during the two months ended 31st March, 1931, the corresponding figure was 16s. 2d.

AUTOMATIC GAS DETECTORS.

Mr. ERNEST WINTERTON: 69.
asked the Secretary for Mines whether he has any report to make to the House in connection with the testing of automatic gas detectors for use in coal mines; and when action requiring the installation of safety detectors may be expected to be taken?

Mr. SHINWELL: After lengthy discussions I have, I believe, secured the co-operation of the manufacturers of an automatic firedamp detector and of two colliery owners in making arrangements for further pit trials, under agreed conditions, during which the accuracy and reliability of the detector will be studied, on my behalf, by the Safety in Mines Research Board. The necessary preparations are already being made and the trials will, I hope, commence almost immediately. The further action to be taken will depend on the results of these trials.

OIL EXTRACTION.

Mr. BATEY: 70.
asked the Lord Privy Seal whether the International Hydrogenation Patents Company has been
registered for the extraction of fuel oil from coal, and whether it is operating in any part of this country; and is he aware that the names of the directors of this company are the names of foreign gentlemen?

Mr. SHINWELL: I have been asked to reply. I understand that the information which has appeared in the Press concerning the formation of the International Hydrogenation Patents Company is substantially correct. It is stated that it is part of an arrangement between the interests in this and other countries which hold the principal patent rights and technical information concerning the hydrogenation process for a pooling of those rights and information, with the Object of securing the proper development of this process. The Company has not been registered in this country, but has its headquarters on the Continent, and as it is to be expected with a Company of this kind, its directorate is international in character. Imperial Chemical Industries, Limited, which is principally interested in the patents rights in this country, is a party to the arrangement, and is represented on the directorate by Lieut.-Colonel G. P. Pollitt, D.S.O. The Company is not an operating company.

Mr. BATEY: 71.
asked the Lord Privy Seal if it is the intention of the Government to build by-product plants for the extraction of fuel oil from coal under State ownership?

Mr. SHINWELL: I regret that it is not yet possible to add anything to the statement on the question of the production of oil from coal which was made by the Lord Privy Seal during the Debate on Unemployment on the 16th April.

WORKMEN'S COMPENSATION.

Mr. TINKER: 76.
asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department if he is now in possession of cases where colliery companies have become bankrupt and have been unable to pay compensation awarded to their injured workmen under the Workmen's Compensation Act; and will he consider amending the Act to bring in compulsory insurance?

The SECRETARY of STATE for the HOME DEPARTMENT (Mr. Clynes): I am aware of a certain number of such cases, and am fully alive to the grave
hardship caused to the workmen, but the situation can only be remedied by legislation of a far-reaching character. The Government have the matter under serious consideration, but I am not in a position at present to make any statement.

Oral Answers to Questions — AFFORESTATION.

Mr. VAUGHAN: 66.
asked the Parliamentary Secretary of the Board of Trade, as representing the Forestry Commissioners, whether he can state the acreage proposed to be planted with spruce or other timber on Crown or other lands in the Royal Forest of Dean during the next 12 months, and the approximate number of men likely to be employed?

The PARLIAMENTARY SECRETARY to the BOARD of TRADE (Mr. W. R. Smith): The planting programme for the Forest of Dean and Highmeadow for the next 12 months is 340 acres. The average number of persons likely to be employed there is 155.

Oral Answers to Questions — ZAMBESI BRIDGE.

Mr. DAY: 67.
asked the Under-Secretary of State for the Colonies whether he is now in a position to make any further statement with reference to the co-ordination of the railway companies which will control the traffic using the Zambesi bridge?

The UNDER-SECRETARY of STATE for the COLONIES (Dr. Drummond Shiels): A detailed account of the arrangements for the co-ordination of the railway companies concerned would involve too long a statement. I must refer my hon. Friend to the conditional agreements of 15th May, 1930, between the Crown Agents for the Colonies and the Central Africa and Shire Highlands Railway Companies and the Trans-Zambesia Railway Company respectively, copies of which were placed in the Library last November. These agreements are not now conditional, but there are certain matters still outstanding.

Oral Answers to Questions — EDUCATION (TEACHERS' SALARIES COMMITTEE).

Mr. WHITE: 73.
asked the President of the Board of Education if he will
state the composition of the Standing Joint Committee on Teachers Salaries?

Mr. BIRKETT: 72.
asked the President of the Board of Education whether he is in a position to state the constituent elements of the Standing Joint Committee on Teachers' Salaries?

Mr. ERNEST BROWN: 74.
asked the President of the Board of Education whether, as a result of their application to the Standing Joint Committee on Teachers' Salaries, the National Union of Women Teachers has been granted representation?

The PARLIAMENTARY SECRETARY to the BOARD of EDUCATION (Mr. Morgan Jones): The bodies now represented on the Standing Joint Committee on the Salaries of Teachers in Public Elementary Schools are the County Councils Association, the London County Council, the Association of Municipal Corporations, the Association of Education Committees, and the National Union of Teachers. I understand that the Standing Joint Committee decided not to make any recommendation in regard to the constitution of the committee.

Mr. WHITE: Can the hon. Gentleman say which of these elements represents the teachers?

Mr. JONES: I take it the National Union of Teachers.

Oral Answers to Questions — KING ALFONSO.

Mr. VAUGHAN: 75.
asked the Home Secretary whether King Alfonso has been requested to give or has given assurance that he will abstain from participation in Spanish political affairs while he is resident in Great Britain?

Mr. CLYNES: No, Sir.

Oral Answers to Questions — POLICE APPOINTMENT (NORTHAMPTONSHIRE).

Mr. TINNE: 77.
asked the Home Secretary whether he has sanctioned the appointment of Mr. Angus Arthur Ferguson as chief constable of Northampton-shire at the age of 27?

Mr. CLYNES: Yes, Sir. The police authority in the county have selected Mr. Ferguson from a large number of candi-
dates, and I have found no reason, either in the provisions of the Police Regulations or on any other ground, for withholding my approval.

Oral Answers to Questions — LOCAL GOVERNMENT ELECTIONS (POLLING HOURS).

Mr. MARLEY: 78.
asked the Home Secretary whether it is his intention to amend the law relating to polling hours in municipal and local elections to permit the same optional extension as exists in Parliamentary elections?

Mr. CLYNES: I am afraid that I cannot at present give any promise to bring in a Bill, but the matter will certainly be very carefully considered when an opportunity for legislation occurs.

Oral Answers to Questions — FILMS (CENSORSHIP).

Sir G. PENNY: 79.
asked the Home Secretary whether, in view of the Sunday Performances (Regulation) Bill, which was recently given a Second Reading in this House, the Government will equip itself with powers to establish a board of film censors responsible to his Department and paid out of public funds?

Mr. CLYNES: I am not aware that the proposals contained in the Sunday Performances (Regulation) Bill afford any reason for contemplating a change in the existing system of film censorship.

Sir G. PENNY: Will the right hon. Gentleman intimate to the Board of Film Censors that there is a large body of opinion which feels that it would be advantageous to have a more rigorous censorship in regard to films shown on Sundays?

Mr. CLYNES: My relations with them are rather uncertain, but I see no objection to conveying that statement to them.

Mr. DAY: Is not the present censorship working very satisfactorily?

Lieut.-Colonel FREMANTLE: May I ask who pays the film censors at the present moment?

Oral Answers to Questions — NATIONAL TREASURES (SALES).

Mr. D. G. SOMERVILLE: 8.
asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer whether he will consider the desirability of taking powers to ensure that national treasures
which are for sale, such as manuscripts, shall first be offered to the British Museum to ascertain whether the nation is disposed to make an offer for them?

The FINANCIAL SECRETARY to the TREASURY (Mr. Pethick-Lawrence): Compulsory notification to the British Museum or other body of impending sales of objects of national interest would require legislation, which, apart from any difficulty in dealing with the matter satisfactorily in that manner, it is not possible to introduce at the present time.

Oral Answers to Questions — GOVERNMENT DEPARTMENTS (CIVILIAN EMPLOYES, KIDBROOKE).

Mr. PALMER: 81.
asked the Financial Secretary to the Treasury if he is aware that employment of civilians and also special service men has been prejudiced at Kidbrooke aerodrome and Post Office Corps and Stores Department by the decision to employ only ex-regular service men who are registered with the National Association for the Employment of Ex-Regular Service Men at 62, Victoria Street, S.W.; and whether, as the result of this is to oblige civilians against their will to join a fighting service in order to secure employment, he will take steps to restore the eligibility of civilians for employment in the Government Departments mentioned?

Mr. PETHICK-LAWRENCE: There is no such bar to the employment of civilians as the hon. Member suggests in the first part of his question. The arrangements for filling certain subordinate posts in Government Departments, such as those of messengers, caretakers, etc., provide for a preference to be given to ex-service men in the following order

(i) Ex-regulars who enlisted on or before 11th November, 1918.
(ii) "Ex-hostilities only" men.
(iii) Ex-Regulars who enlisted after 11th November, 1918.

No man is taken on unless he is fully qualified

This policy is of long standing, and it is not proposed to alter it.

Mr. PALMER: Would my hon. Friend like to have cases in which the facts are contrary to the first part of his answer?

Mr. PETHICK-LAWRENCE: If my hon. Friend has cases which are contrary to the answer I have given, I shall, of course, be glad to have them, in order to check the facts.

Oral Answers to Questions — CIVIL SERVICE (ROYAL COMMISSION).

Mr. HORE-BELISHA: 82.
asked the Financial Secretary to the Treasury if he can now state when he anticipates the report of the Royal Commission set up to investigate the conditions in the Civil Service will be completed?

Mr. PETHICK-LAWRENCE: I have nothing to add to the latter part of the answer I gave to the hon. Member on the 5th March.

Oral Answers to Questions — RAILWAY BRIDGE SCHEME, HAYES, MIDDLESEX.

Major LLEWELLIN: 83.
asked the Minister of Transport whether he has any further information that he can give with regard to the proposed new bridge over the Great Western Railway at Hayes?

The MINISTER of TRANSPORT (Mr. Herbert Morrison): The reconstruction of this bridge has been delayed mainly owing to the necessity of making provision for developments which the railway company have in contemplation. Negotiations are proceeding between the company and the Middlesex County Council; but a settlement has not yet been reached.

Major LLEWELLIN: Will the right hon. Gentleman urge on all concerned the advisability of prompt action in this matter?

Mr. MORRISON: We are very anxious that it should be proceeded with as early as practicable, and shall do all that we can.

BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE.

Ordered, That the Proceedings of the Committee of Ways and Means be exempted, at this day's Sitting, from the provisions of the Standing Order (Sittings of the House).—[The Prime Minister.]

KITCHEN AND REFRESHMENT ROOMS (HOUSE OF COMMONS).

Special Report from the Select Committee brought up, and read;

Report to lie upon the Table, and to be printed.

SELECTION (STANDING COMMITTEES).

STANDING COMMITTEE D.

Mr. William Nicholson reported from the Committee of Selection; That they had discharged the following Member from Standing Committee D (added in respect of the Town and Country Planning Bill): Colonel Lane Fox; and had appointed in substitution: the Earl of Dalkeith.

Report to lie upon the Table.

FINANCIAL STATEMENT (1931–32).

Copy ordered, "of Statement of Revenue and Expenditure as laid before the House by Mr. Chancellor of the Exchequer when opening the Budget."— [Hr. Pethick-Lawrence.]

Orders of the Day — WAYS AND MEANS.

Considered in Committee.

[Sir ROBBERT YOUNG in the Chair.]

Orders of the Day — FINANCIAL STATEMENT.

The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER (Mr. Philip Snowden): It is the usual practice to open the Budget Speech with a review of the income and expenditure and the debt operations of the previous year. With the indulgence, I hope, of the Committee—[H0N. MEMBERS: "Hear, hear!"]—I have this year substituted for the usual oral report on these matters a printed statement which hon. Members already have in their hands. I hope the Committee will approve of this innovation, which I have adopted to lighten my task in the circumstances and which also will have the advantage of relieving the Committee from the boredom of a recital of dry facts with which they are in the main already familiar. It will also have the advantage of bringing nearer that part of the Budget Statement in which the Committee are really interested. The Memorandum with the Blue Paper may be regarded as part of the Budget Speech and taken as read, and with the permission of Mr. Speaker, will be printed as a part of my speech in the OFFICIAL REPORT.

The CHAIRMAN: I am sure we all deplore the reasons for this suggestion. The matter has been referred to Mr. Speaker, and Mr. Speaker approves, and I think every hon. and right hon. Gentleman in the Committee will approve; but I must lay it down definitely and clearly that it must not be taken as a precedent on any future occasion.

Mr. SNOWDEN: Thank you.

Following is the printed statement:

REVIEW OF THE FINANCIAL YEAR 1930–31.

OUT-TURN.

1. As shown by the Tables on pp. 2 and 3 of the Financial Statement, the Ordinary Revenue, including the appropriation of £16,000,000 from the Rating Relief Suspense Account, amounted to £775,895,000, exceeding the previous year by £41,706,000, but falling short of the
estimate by £13,550,000. Supplementary Estimates and Excess Votes amounted to £14,889,000, but as the result of savings of £11,430,000 on Debt Interest and Management and smaller savings on other heads the Ordinary Expenditure exceeded the estimate by £532,000 only. The saving on debt interest and management was, under the law relating to the Fixed Debt Charge, added to the Sinking Fund; and the result was therefore—

£


Margin provided in Budget Estimates
2,236,000


Less—
£



Shortage of Revenue
13,550,000



Excess on Ordinary Expenditure
532,000



Addition to Sinking Fund
11,430,000





25,512,000


Shortfall

£23,276,000

The total Sinking Fund amounted to £66,830,000 and deducting the shortfall of £23,276,000 the sum applied out of revenue to the reduction of debt was £43,554,000.

REVENUE.

2. Inland Revenue.

The total receipt of Inland Revenue was £430,967,000, as against a Budget estimate of £436,750,000, giving a deficit of £5,783,000. This deficit can be more than accounted for by a heavy fall in the receipt of stamp duties, which yielded only £20,650,000, as against a Budget estimate of £27,000,000. The fall in stamp duty revenue reflects principally the decline in Stock Exchange activities, the duties in connection with which yielded in 1930 about £4,000,000 less than in 1929 and about £9,000,000 less than in 1928.

The Income Tax receipt of £256,047,000, representing the Income Tax at the standard rate, and the Sur-tax receipt of £67,830,000, representing the Income Tax in excess of the standard rate, gave a combined receipt of £323,877,000, as against a combined estimate of £324,250,000, and the total receipt from income taxation thus fell little short of expectation. Taken separately, the Income Tax at standard rate was £3,703,000 short of the estimate and the
Sur-tax yielded £3,330,000 more than the estimate. The fall in the Income Tax at standard rate was due to a slight fall in the rate of collection of tax in the quarter ended the 31st March, 1931. The surplus in the case of Sur-tax was due partly to a higher collection of arrears for past years and partly to a higher rate of collection of the tax payable on the 1st January, 1931, than was assumed in the Budget estimate.

The increase in the rates of Estate Duty effected by the Finance Act, 1930, did not yield quite as much as had been expected, and the total receipt from Death Duties, namely, £82,610,000, was £390,000 short of the Budget estimate.

The receipt of Excess Profits Duty and Corporations Profits Tax amounted to £3,000,000, giving a surplus of £1,300,000 over the Budget estimate. The yield from these repealed taxes represents the excess of collection of arrears over repayments for past years, and the amount of repayments required in 1930 proved to be less than was anticipated.

The yield of £830,000 for Land Tax and Mineral Rights Duty accords with the Budget Estimate and no comment is called for in respect of these duties, the yield of which is generally stable.

3. Customs and Excise.

The Budget Estimate was £252,570,000. The actual revenue amounted, however, to only £245,401,000, showing a deficit of £7,169,000, of which £1,309,000 occurred under Customs and £5,860,000 under Excise. There were forestalments at the end of the year estimated to amount altogether to about £3,000,000, of which nearly two-thirds occurred in tobacco, nearly one-quarter in spirits, and small amounts in sugar, wine, and cocoa. But for this disturbance, the deficit on the Budget Estimate would have been approximately £10,000,000.

The shortage is attributed mainly to the trade depression, the full intensity of which was not foreseen when the Estimates were framed. Spirits, beer, and wine were all down, despite the gain to spirits and wine from forestalments. Sugar also failed to reach the Estimate by over £700,000, partly because consumption may have fallen, and partly because the heavy postponements which occurred in 1929–30 were not made good in 1930–31
as expected. The receipts of duty on imported motor cars fell below Estimate by nearly £1,200,000. On the other hand, tobacco, oil, and entertainments showed surpluses, but in the case of tobacco this was entirely due to the forestalments mentioned above, actual consumption having expanded less than anticipated.

4. Other Heads.

Ordinary Revenue, other than Inland Revenue and Customs and Excise, amounted to £99,527,000 against an Estimate of £99,875,000. The yield under the different heads was in each case very slightly below the Estimate.

EXPENDITURE.

5. Consolidated Fund Services.

Interest and Management of the Debt amounted to £293,170,000. Treasury Bills interest at £12,475,000 and Savings Certificates interest at £16,054,000 were abnormally low, being much below the cost in the preceding year and the Estimate for 1930. It was for this reason that the amount available for Debt redemption rose to £66,830,000.

Payments to the Northern Ireland Exchequer exceeded the estimate by £425,000, mainly on account of unemployment in that area. Other Consolidated Fund Services showed a saving of £404,000, spread over miscellaneous heads.

6. Supply Services.

The main supplementary Estimates were required in connection with—



£


Ministry of Labour
10,500,000


Beet Sugar Subsidy
600,000


Grants for Unemployment Schemes in necessitous areas
500,000


Colonial and Middle Eastern Services
400,000

The Supplementary Estimate for the Ministry of Labour was due to the increased cost of transitional benefit, arising from exceptional unemployment.

The total Supplementary Estimates and Excess Votes amounted to £14,889,000, which was offset by savings elsewhere on Supply Services to the extent of £4,223,000. The net increase in Supply Services over the Estimate was thus £10,666,000.

NATIONAL DEBT.

7. The detailed application of the Sinking Fund (£66,830,000) is shown in the table on page 4 of the Financial Statement. The surplus of Ordinary Revenue over Ordinary Expenditure, which is the true figure of the cash applied to debt reduction out of revenue, was, as already stated, £43,554,000, and, in addition, £9,057,000 cash was applied to the reduction of Debt outside the Budget from the proceeds of the German Government Mobilisation Loan.

The total nominal deadweight debt on the 31st March, 1931, was £7,413,278,000, a reduction in the year on the face value of the debt of £55,761,000.

The principal debt operations of the year were:

(i) The redemption of £24,568,000 of 5¼per Cent. Treasury Bonds from the proceeds of issue of 4¼ Conversion Loan under the prospectus of February, 1930; and
(ii) The redemption of £75,100,000 of the 4 per Cent. War Loan, tax compounded, and of £11,037,000 4¼ per Cent. Treasury Bonds from the proceeds of issue of 4 per Cent. Treasury Bonds by tender, at an average price of £100 11s. 6d.

The annual saving effected by these operations was approximately £900,000, including the gain to Income Tax revenue, estimated at £650,000, arising from the substitution of a taxable security for the tax compounded 4 per Cent. War Loan.

The market prices of representative Government stocks improved during the year as follows:



31st March,1930.
31st March,1931.


3¼per Cent. Conversion Loan
78½
79⅛


4 per Cent. Consols
88⅝
90⅛


5 per Cent. War Loan
103
104¼


4 per Cent. Funding Loan
91¼
91¾


3 per Cent. Local Loans
65¾
66⅛

DEBT POSITION.

Continuing his speech, Mr. SNOWDEN said:

I shall, therefore, refer only briefly to last year. There was a deficit, that is to say, an excess of total expenditure
over total income of £23,250,000; but, as the total expenditure included the very large sum of £66,830,431 for Sinking Fund, the Committee will see that the net result of the year is a surplus applicable to debt reduction of over £43,500,000. Apart from that there was a sum of over £9,000,000 received by us from the proceeds of the German Mobilisation Loan, and this has been applied to debt reduction outside the Budget. The apparent deficit of £23,000,000 is apt to be misleading especially to foreign opinion. On the basis of some foreign Budgets and commercial practice instead of a deficit of £23,000,000, the year would have closed with a, surplus of £43,500,000. The net sum applied to Debt reduction is in reality the surplus of income over expenditure. It says much for the soundness of our national financial position that, in a year of unparalleled industrial depression, we have not only been able to pay our way but to make such a substantial reduction of the Debt. I do not intend to make detailed comparisons with the Budgets of foreign countries, but I should be very much surprised to learn that there is any other country, however sky-scraping its tariff walls may be, which can show an equally good result in such a period of world-wide disaster.

The Committee will recollect that in 1928 the fixed debt charge was put at £355,000,000 a year, and that by last year's Finance Act this sum was augmented by £5,000,000, £5,000,000 and £4,500,000 for the years 1930–31, 1931–32 and 1932–33 respectively. The object of this was to pay off the deficit of £14,500,000 of 1929–30. Since that decision was taken we have received, as I have mentioned, over £9,000,000 from the German Mobilisation Loan and applied it to debt reduction outside the Budget. Therefore, the actual net sum applied to debt reduction last year, after deducting the £23,000,000 deficit, was £52,500,000. In the exceptional circumstances of the present time, I feel that I am entitled to propose to the Committee that the last £9,500,000 of the 1929 deficit should be regarded as sufficiently met by this windfall from the German Mobilisation Loan, and that no further burden should be placed on this year's and next year's Budget for this purpose. The first £5,000,000 of the 1929 deficit was duly
provided for last year. That sum is included in and is part of last year's deficit of £23,000,000. It will have been noted that last year I provided £360,000,000 for Debt service, but savings made on the estimated cost of Treasury Bills and Savings Certificate interest enabled an addition to be made to the sum estimated to be available for Debt reduction of £11,500,000. This year I am making a liberal allowance for the cost of Treasury Bills and Savings Certificate interest, and it is not improbable that these items will again make an addition to Debt reduction beyond the sum estimated for in the fixed Debt charge, but in the present state of financial uncertainty I think it best to be on the safe side.

I do not think the Committee should expect me or will expect me to make provision by an addition to the fixed Debt charge—that is by an increase of taxation—to meet this shortage of £23,000,000 immediately out of present resources. Moreover, I am confidently expecting that, as the outcome of the recommendations of the Economy Committee set up by the vote of all parties in the House, considerable reductions of expenditure will be made during the year, which will automatically go to Debt reduction. It is also possible that during the year conditions may be favourable for considerable Debt conversion operations, which will in that event reduce the cost of the Debt services, and automatically increase Debt reduction within the fixed Debt charge. In view of these facts, although I am not making any direct addition to the fixed Debt charge, I hope savings will be made which will wipe off a considerable part of the deficit of £23,000,000 during the current financial year. Should this expectation not be realised, it will be the duty of Parliament to deal with the matter when better times return. Although I have always favoured every possible effort at Debt reduction, I have always agreed with Mr. Gladstone's view that, in times of industrial depression and unemployment, it is better to use our resources to stimulate trade than to make undue sacrifices for the reduction of Debt. It is in times of prosperity and abounding revenue and of Budget surpluses that we can afford to lessen the intolerable burden of debt, and to liberate resources for schemes of
economic and social reform. The fixed Debt charge for the current year will, therefore, be the £355,000,000 laid down by the Finance Act of 1928.

ESTIMATE OF INCOME AND EXPENDITURE.

I am now in a position to give the Committee the estimate of income and expenditure for the current year on the existing basis. I estimate the total yield of Inland Revenue Duties at £437,000,000, consisting of £248,000,000 for Income Tax, £72,000,000 for Sur-tax, £90,000,000 for Death Duties, £24,000,000 for Stamp Duties, and £3,000,000 for the remaining items. The yield of the Income Tax last year was £256,000,000. Normally, I could have looked forward to an additional £3,000,000 from the full effect of last year's increase of rate and also for some general growth; but the fall in profits in 1930 in consequence of the world depression in trade has, of course, affected very adversely the prospects of the Income Tax yield in this year, the assessments for which are based upon the profits of 1930. Instead of a growth, I find myself faced with a serious contraction in the yield. The depression in trade will not affect the yield of Sur-tax in 1931 so seriously, for it will depend upon the statutory income for the year 1930. We can, therefore, count upon the full effect of the increased rates of tax laid down by last year's Finance Act. In the case of Death Duties, I look forward to almost the full year's gain from the increased rates of last year's Finance Act, and, taking all the circumstances into account, I think I am justified in estimating for a yield of £90,000,000. The other Inland Revenue Duties call for no special comment, except that I might observe that the yield of the Stamp Duties last year was the lowest since 1921, and in looking for £24,000,000 in the current year, I am counting upon some recovery in Stock Exchange activity, the slump in which is mainly responsible for last year's fall.

I now come to Customs and Excise. I hope the tide of depression, which upset all our expectations last year, has reached its limits and that better times are in store for us. But it will take a little time after the tide has definitely turned before the Revenue will feel the benefit, and I must, therefore, face the prospect of a further decline in the Customs and Excise revenue in the near
future. I accordingly put the estimate of Customs and Excise at £238,000,000, namely, Customs £118,150,000, and Excise £119,850,000. The total figure, indeed, shows a drop of nearly £7,500,000 on last year's revenue. But towards the end of the year there were forestalments in a number of articles, particularly tobacco. These forestalments are estimated to have added to last year's Revenue something like £3,000,000, and, in doing so, they deprived me of a similar sum this year. When allowance is made for this factor, which "counts two on a division," my estimate for this year is really only about £1,500,000 down on last year's proper revenue.

The consumption of alcoholic liquors fell last year, and I am estimating for further falls in revenue this year, accentuated in the case of spirits and wine by forestalments. The fall in the consumption of alcoholic liquors seems now to be a permanent tendency socially, and from the point of view of national and social well-being it is to be heartily welcomed, however inconvenient it may be for the Exchequer.

Other items of revenue show little variation from last year. I put the Exchequer share of the Motor Vehicle Duties at £5,000,000; the Post Office net receipts at £12,200,000; Crown Lands at £1,300,000; Receipts from Sundry Loans at £33,500,000; and Miscellaneous Revenue at £35,000,000. The estimates of revenue which I have so far given amount to £762,000,000 and are nearly £2,000,000 above the actual yield of the corresponding items last year, though £11,000,000 below the estimates of last year. The revenue last year was fortified by the addition of £16,000,000 from the Rating Relief Suspense Account. From this source only £4,000,000 is available this year, and nothing in future years. The addition of this £4,000,000 gives me a grand total of £766,000,000 of revenue for the current year.

4.0 p.m.

Turning to the expenditure side, the Committee have had before them already the Estimates for the Supply Services. They amount to £439,016,000. In view of the appointment of the Economy Committee, I trust that the actual expenditure will fall considerably below these Estimates. Out of the Fixed Debt Charge
of £355,000,000, I have to allot£302,900,000 to interest and management of the Debt, leaving over £52,000,000 available for the Sinking Fund, mainly for contractual obligations. The figure for interest and management of the Debt is higher than the actual results of last year, but I cannot confidently rely, as I have said, on the continuance of the extreme cheapness of Treasury Bills, and the low encashments of Savings Certificates. With payments to Northern Ireland at £6,350,000, and Miscellaneous Consolidated Fund Charges at £3,000,000, I reach a total estimated expenditure of £803,366,000. This, when compared with an estimated revenue of £766,000,000, leaves a gap to be bridged of £37,366,000. This deficit is greater than last year's actual shortage of £23,276,000 by some £14,000,000. This is mainly Accounted for by the need for providing £12,000,000 more for the de-rating scheme — a liability left to me by the previous Government—owing to the Rating Relief Suspense Account having, as I have already said, been practically exhausted. I have also had to provide £30,000,000 for transitional benefit. The original Estimate for this service last year was £10,500,000, increased by Supplementary Estimates to £22,000,000, and this year's figure is £8,000,000 higher still. These two items together—£12,000,000 for de-rating and £8,000,000 extra for transitional benefit — are equal in amount to more than half the estimated deficit of £37,366,000. That is the estimated deficit for this year which I have to make up—a figure which will be disappointing to the Jeremiahs who have been forecasting a deficit of anything up to £70,000,000.

SAVINGS CERTIFICATES.

Before coming to the proposals relating to taxation in the current year, I will refer briefly to certain other matters which will appear in the Finance Bill. The earlier issues of Savings Certificates are due for repayment at various dates from 31st March, 1932, to 30th September, 1933, and we have no power at present to extend their currency. I intend to seek such powers in the Finance Bill so as to enable us to offer present holders an extension of their investment. The Clause will not, of course, impair in any way the right of the holder to claim repayment at any time.

ROAD FUND.

It will be necessary for the Exchequer to come to the assistance of the Road Fund this year to meet the cost of road schemes, including works expedited in connection with the present state of employment. The necessary power will be sought in the Finance Bill to enable a loan to be raised for this purpose.

MOTOR BICYCLES.

In order to encourage the manufacture in this country of a new type of light motor bicycle which is now being rapidly developed on the Continent, I propose to introduce a special rate of duty for motor bicycles, the engines of which have a cylinder capacity not exceeding 150 cubic centimetres. The annual tax proposed for vehicles falling within this limit will be 15s. in lieu of the present rate of 30s. The concession will take effect from 1st January next, and its effect upon this year's revenue will be negligible.

DEDUCTION OF INCOME TAX FROM DIVIDENDS.

Under a long established practice, companies have deducted Income Tax from the full amount of any dividends paid by them out of profits of a revenue nature irrespective of the amount on which the company bas been charged to tax for the particular period to which the dividend relates, and the full amount of such dividends has been regarded as income of the shareholders for all purposes, that is to say, not only for the purpose of assessment to Sur-tax, but also for the purpose of repayment of Income Tax to people who are not liable. One or two attempts have been recently made in various quarters to upset this practice. Although in a recent case—Hamilton and the Commissioners of Inland Revenue—the practice has been upheld in the Courts, I am advised that in certain circumstances, which did not arise in that case, the position may not be free from some element of doubt. The matter is of vital importance—in the first place to the companies with regard to their right to deduct tax from their dividends; secondly, to the small shareholder who is entitled to the repayment of Income Tax; and, thirdly, to the Exchequer as regards the due assessment of Sur-tax. It cannot, therefore, be left
to the hazards of further litigation. I shall, accordingly, ask the House to agree to legislation in order to make the position perfectly clear and in order to avoid any further legal controversy.

COLLECTORS OF TAXES.

I am proposing a change in the machinery for collecting the Income Tax. Collectors of taxes have for a long time claimed that their service should be reorganised under Civil Service conditions. It is my own view—I stated it in the House seven years ago—that this service is in need of comprehensive reform in the interests both of the State and the staff. The collectors have become convinced—and I am clear that they are right—that as a practical matter reorganisation is only possible if the collecting service is placed under a single undivided control. I dissent absolutely from the view that this reform would be injurious to the interests of any taxpayer, great or small. Centralised collection under the Board of Inland Revenue was recommended by the Royal Commission on the Income Tax. It is already in operation for practically the whole of Scotland and Northern Ireland, and for 17 large collecting areas in England and Wales, including aristocratic Bournemouth and industrial Bradford, Bristol, Cardiff, Hull, Halifax, Leeds, Liverpool, Manchester, Newcastle and Southampton. In none of these areas have there been any complaints on the part of the taxpayer. The Finance Bill will, therefore, provide that appointments of collectors will in future vest in the Commissioners of Inland Revenue.

ADDITIONAL REVENUE REQUIRED.

I now return to the problem of finding the necessary additional revenue to cover the prospective deficit of £37,366,000. Such a problem must necessarily be a grievous anxiety to any Chancellor at any time, but my task is exceptionally hard since the great depression in world trade which has produced the Budget problem is essentially the strongest obstacle to any increase in the rate of taxation. I have not lacked advisers in my difficulties. The party opposite would find an easy solution of this problem by the imposition of duties upon everything. From these duties a sum of £50,000,000 to £100,000,000 a year would fall into the lap of the Exchequer
as a gift from Providence, like the Israelites' manna dropped down from Heaven. No one is to pay these duties, and, incidentally, they will be levied on goods which Protection has prevented from coming into the country. A revenue tariff is advocated as the first instalment of a high general protective tariff, and so far as it produces revenue, as a means of transferring taxation to the general consumer for the relief of the direct taxpayer. It is not to be accompanied, we are told, by countervailing Excise Duties, but it will levy an Excise Duty on every article of home production, with this difference, that this Excise Duty on home production will not come as revenue to the Exchequer, but will be pocketed by the manufacturers in increased prices.

We are asked by this proposal for a revenue tariff to go back to the pernicious taxation methods of a century ago, which were graphically described by William Pitt when he said:
There is a way in which you can tax the last rag from the back, and the last bite from the mouth without causing a murmur against heavy taxation and that is by taxing a large number of articles in general use. The tax will pass into the price of the article. The people will grumble about high prices and hard times, but they will never know that the hard times are caused by heavy taxation.
A revenue tariff, apart from its Protectionist object, is a means of relieving the well-to-do at the expense of the poor, and is an indirect method of reducing wages. I shall never be a party to any such imposition. Taxes which would reduce the main consuming power of the masses of the people, apart from all other considerations, must be harmful to trade, and I have explained on several previous occasions my desire to avoid, if possible, all forms of taxation which, whether from the economic or the psychological point of view, would have a depressing effect on industry, and which might retard recovery in trade and employment. Moreover, it is only too clear that in many directions increased rates of taxation would at this time produce a disappointingly low increase in yield. It will be obvious to the Committee that I shall have to propose additions to taxation. On the other hand, the present problem is largely a temporary one. I regard this Budget like a war Budget
as one dealing with a temporary emergency and justifying temporary measures. A revival of trade, when it comes, will be followed by an expansion of revenue and by a reduction on the expenditure side of the account in respect of unemployment.

EXCHANGE ACCOUNT.

In the midst of this widespread economic blizzard, more severe than our generation has ever known, I feel justified in seeking, as the lesser of two evils, relief by means of non-recurrent revenues and temporary expedients, somewhat similar to those to which my predecessor resorted so freely in more prosperous times, and which I admit in those circumstances I condemned, and should condemn again in normal conditions. Unfortunately, the depredations of my predecessor have left few hen roosts to rob. There are, however, two resources which I can legitimately and without hardship call to my assistance as expedients in this time of unparalleled stringency. As a result of the advertisement given to the fact, most hon. Members are aware that there exists what is known as the Exchange Account, which represents a sum of £33,000,000 advanced from Votes of Credit during the War and utilised by the Treasury in purchasing foreign exchange to finance payment of our obligations abroad. This is not an account to which expenditure is finally charged but is in the nature of a revolving fund. It has enabled us to buy foreign exchange under favourable conditions in advance of the date upon which we have payments to make. If conditions were unfavourable or foreign currency dear, the possession of a reserve has enabled us to keep out of the market and abstain from buying until conditions improved. The advantages are so obvious that no defence of the Account is needed, and down to a recent date no possibility existed of reducing the amount below £33,000,000. The new circumstances which have modified the situation arise from the Hague agreement and the establishment of the Bank of International Settlement. Previously we received payment of reparations and of instalments of the French and Italian War debts in sterling, but we have now been able to arrange that these sums shall be placed to our credit in the Bank for International Settlement in dollars, which we can utilise in making
payments on our own foreign debt. These arrangements have been working for nearly a year quite satisfactorily.

It does not follow that the Exchange Account can be dispensed with altogether. The dates on which we receive dollars abroad do not match exactly the dates on which we require them for use, and it would be, moreover, imprudent to rely exclusively upon one source of supply. But there is no doubt that the size of the account is excessive for present or future needs and that without injury to the public interest it can be reduced by £20,000,000. I am thus in a position to increase the miscellaneous receipts for this year by that amount.

I have spoken of the Exchange Account hitherto as if it were a fixed sum of £33,000,000, that being the amount which the revolving fund has received from the Exchequer and not repaid. The pegging of the Exchange during the War was necessarily an operation involving expense, and for a long time the assets of the account were below its nominal figure. The position has now been reversed and its assets now exceed its nominal figure by more that £3,000,000. This reserve being in existing conditions no longer required, I have allowed for this receipt in my estimate already given of the miscellaneous revenue for the current year. The further amount to be found is thus reduced to £17,366,000.

INCOME TAX (ALTERATION OF INSTALMENTS).

I have already explained that the yield of the Income Tax this year will suffer from the fall in profits in 1930, due to trade depression. This fall in the yield of the Income Tax is, however, temporary and we can look forward to a higher revenue as the depression passes away. As I have said, I cannot ignore the psychological effect on trade and commerce of any increase in direct taxation at a time when they are, I hope, on the point of emerging from an unprecedented slump. I have, therefore, decided not to propose any increase in the Income Tax. I propose, however, to tide over the temporary period of low yield of that tax by partially withdrawing a concession which was made in the second Finance Act of 1915. Before that time, Income Tax was payable in one sum on the 1st January. In the second Finance Act of 1915, a concession was made under which in the case of certain Income Tax payers charged
under Schedules B, D and E, it became payable in two instalments, on the 1st January and the 1st July. It will be remembered that in 1927 my predecessor balanced his Budget by withdrawing a similar concession in the case of Schedule A, and by making the whole Income Tax under Schedule A payable on the 1st January. I am not proposing to go as far as he did. The modification which I shall ask the House to approve is the substitution for the present equal instalments of tax under Schedules B, D and E, of a first instalment of three-quarters on the 1st January next and a second instalment of one-quarter, that is the remainder of the year's tax, on the 1st July following. In other words, as the law now stands, the taxpayers in question would pay the 1931 Income Tax on their profits or emoluments, one half on 1st January, 1932, and one-half on 1st July, 1932. I now propose that they should pay three-fourths on 1st January, 1932, and one-quarter on 1st July, 1932. The result will be that the Exchequer will get in these cases an extra quarter of the year's tax within the present financial year. It is estimated that the gain on this year will be £10,000,000. Next year's yield will not, of course, be affected by this change, for what is lost on the 1st July, 1932, will in fact be regained on 1st January, 1933. The taxpayers concerned are individuals and firms engaged in trades, professions or husbandry, and employés: weekly wage earners whose Income Tax is assessed half-yearly will not be affected by the change.

I cannot expect that this modification of the concession made in 1915 will be welcomed by the individuals affected, but I feel confident that they will realise the difficulties which have occasioned it and will be willing to make this contribution to our present national needs. They will have eight months within which to arrange their affairs in order to make the additional payment in January, and they will have a correspondingly reduced payment to make in the following July. I think that most of them will at any rate feel that this arrangement is preferable to an increased charge in two equal instalments. The proposal affects only a small proportion of the produce of the Income Tax, as the amount of tax collected from the second instalment represents only about one-tenth of the total annual payment. The great bulk
of the Income Tax is collected either by deduction at the source at the time of receipt of the income or by direct payment on the 1st January, and to the extent that one-quarter of their tax will still remain payable on the 1st July, the taxpayers affected by this proposal will continue to enjoy an advantage. The estimated deficit is thus reduced by £30,000,000, leaving me still £7,500,000 short.

OIL DUTY.

I have reviewed in my search for revenue the whole field of taxation, both direct and indirect, and after careful consideration I have come to the conclusion to increase the duty on oil. The present rate of duty is 4d. per gallon, and I propose to raise it as from to-morrow to 6d., an increase of 2d. The consumption of oil has steadily increased since the duty was imposed in 1928, despite the rise in the price of petrol by 4¼d. per gallon which then occurred and a further subsequent rise of 2¼d. which took place in March, 1929. Last September, however, the price was reduced by 2d. per gallon, and a further similar reduction was made again only last month. I am told, with what authority I do not know, that the trade is only awaiting the introduction of the Budget to make a still further reduction in the price of petrol. The proposed increase in the duty will, therefore, still leave petrol no dearer than it was before March and lower in price than it was before last September. The price will indeed be slightly less than it was after my predecessor imposed the original duty of 4d. In these circumstances, I do not anticipate that the tax will appreciably affect consumption, and I estimate that it will yield me exactly the sum I still require, £7,500,000 in the current year and over £8,000,000 in a full year.

I have never liked the Oil Duty. I withdraw nothing that I have said about this duty, but I find the tax in existence and fruitful in its yield, and the stern necessity of the present emergency, and that alone, compels me to make use of it for the time being. I should regard this addition of 2d. as having a claim for remission when we are in a position to remit taxation. I can think of no Customs or Excise Duty, an increase of which would cause less hardship and, moreover, judging from the Press fore-
casts of new taxation there would be general disappointment if I did not increase this duty.

BALANCE SHEET.

The three sources of income which I have mentioned, namely, the Exchange Account, the revised arrangement for the collection of Schedule B, D and E of Income Tax, and the increase in the Oil Duty will yield together £37,500,000, which will give me the sum I need to balance the Budget. The balance sheet for the current year will thus be,


Revenue
£803,500,000


Expenditure
£803,366,000


leaving a nominal margin of £134,000.

I have made no provision for supplementary expenditure. It would be contrary to all experience if no item should arise during the year calling for a Supplementary Estimate. If prosperity should return, it may well be that a margin will be found in the form of a yield from taxation in excess of the forecasts I have made. Apart from this, I definitely contemplate that any gap which occurs in the finance of the year should be met by economy, and for that reason I shall anxiously await the recommendation of the committee which is at this moment examining the field of national expenditure on the instruction of all parties in the House of Commons.

SUMMARY.

In addressing the Committee last year I expressed the opinion that in the absence of unforseeable calamities no further increases of taxation would be needed in the current year. No one at that time had foreseen the full extent of the crisis, financial and industrial, through which the world was about to pass or had realised how slow recovery would be. When much later the position had become clear, there was of course no lack of prophecies of complete ruin and disaster to our finances. When all is said and done, however, we have passed through one desperately bad year without too great a strain, and the burdens which I have been compelled to propose this year fall far short of the gloomy predictions which have been current. I do not for one moment con-ceal my opinion that the position continues to be grave and that the finances of next year may present difficult problems. Indeed, if the world depression fails meanwhile to lift, reduction of
expenditure will be the only alternative to increased taxation. For these reasons, it will be for the House to take carefully into account the proposals that may emerge from the work both of the Economy Committee and the Unemployment Commission.

Those who look only upon the dark side may very well say that I have only succeeded in postponing difficulties for a year. But surely that is something to be thankful for, especially when the possible difficulties may not have to be faced if the House of Commons will give effect to the expressed determination of all parties to eliminate unnecessary expenditure without impairing the efficiency of essential services. But whatever next year may have in store, there are recuperative forces at work which will in time afford relief. If we can effect substantial economies during the year, and if there is some improvement in trade, I do not think next year's Budget will be unduly alarming, but failing this a heavy increase of taxation will be inevitable next year, which I have this year happily been able to avert.

LAND VALUES.

Now I turn to what I regard as the main feature of this year's Budget. The Committee will remember that in my last Budget speech I announced the introduction of a Land Valuation Bill as a prelude to levying an imposition on this basis. The Bill was, in fact, introduced later in the year, but the pressure of public business made it impossible for us to proceed with it. This year we are going to deal with the matter. Since that time I have given considerable thought to the whole subject, and I now propose to include in this year's Finance Bill provisions for the taxation of land values; provisions for the necessary and preliminary step of valuation, together with provisions for the imposition of a tax on land values upon the valuations thus obtained. I think it will be obvious, both on general grounds and also from the experience of the scheme of land value taxation introduced by my right hon. Friend the Member for Carnarvon Boroughs (Mr. Lloyd George), that it would be unwise, if not impracticable, to attempt to value and tax concurrently.

The valuation is the first and, indeed, the essential step to any scheme under which a contribution to the needs of the community can be levied upon land values. I propose that the valuation should be substantially completed before the tax begins to be levied. Thus, the impost will not become operative during the current financial year, and this will necessitate a somewhat special procedure, about which I shall have something further to say in a moment. Let me first say that the valuation will, I hope, be completed within a period of two years from the passing of the Bill. It will thus be available, subject to periodical revision, as a basis upon which to charge an annual tax for 1933–34 and subsequent years. That tax, for which provision will also be included in the Bill, will be at the rate of ld. in the £ on the capital land value.

Now as to procedure, and an explanation of the mystery of the Prime Minister's statement of last Thursday. I am advised that it is not possible to include in this year's Finance Bill provision for the imposition of taxation in a future year without taking certain special measures. I propose, therefore, as soon as the usual discussions on the other Budget Resolutions in Committee have been concluded to bring before the House a separate Resolution. This Resolution will authorise provision to be made in this year's Finance Bill for giving effect to any Resolution which may be passed in Committee of Ways and Means for imposing a tax on land values to come into operation at a date subsequent to the expiration of the current financial year. If that special Resolution is passed by the House, the next step will be to introduce in Committee of Ways and Means the necessary Resolution authorising the imposition of a tax on land values. That Resolution will then be debated in Committee of Ways and Means and on the Report stage will be dealt with as one of the ordinary Budget Resolutions. In introducing the Ways and Means Resolution, I shall, of course, make a full exposition of my actual proposals. In view of the additional opportunities for discussion of this topic which the proposed special procedure entails, I am sure that the Committee will think it unnecessary for me to go into further detail this afternoon.

The proposals that we shall submit fat dealing with this reform will, I am convinced, be heartily welcomed and supported by the great majority of the House of Commons and the country. The scandal of the private appropriation of land values created by the enterprise and industry of the people and by the expenditure of public money, has been tolerated far too long. In asserting the right of the community to a share in what has been created by the community, we are taking a step which will be approved not only by the Labour and the Liberal parties, which have long advocated this reform, but also by a large number of Conservatives, whose sense of justice is outraged by glaring examples of the exploitation of the public by private land monopolists. The present system stands in the way of social and economic progress, inflicts crushing burdens on industry and hinders municipal development. When we have carried this Measure, as I am sure we shall, and as we are determined to do, we shall look back upon the Budget of this year as a landmark on the road of social and economic progress, and as one further stage towards the emancipation of the people from the tyranny and the injustice of private land monopoly.

INCOME TAX (INCREASE OF CUSTOMS DUTY ON HYDROCARBON OILS).

Motion made, and Question proposed,
That as from the twenty-eighth day of April, nineteen hundred and thirty-one, the customs duty on hydrocarbon oils shall be at the rate per gallon of sixpence instead of fourpence, and the rebate to be allowed on the delivery for home consumption of hydrocarbon oils, other than light oils, shall be at the rate per gallon of sixpence instead of fourpence.
And it is hereby declared that it is expedient in the public interest that this Resolution shall have statutory effect under the provisions of the Provisional Collection of Taxes Act, 1913."—[Mr. Snowden.]

Mr. CHAMBERLAIN: The practice has grown up in our Parliamentary proceedings that the speaker who follows the Chancellor of the Exchequer on Budget day, usually one of his predecessors in that office, should not enter into any serious criticisms of the proposals which the Chancellor of the Exchequer may have submitted to the House. He has been accustomed in recent years, as it were, to shake hands with the Chancellor before engaging in the prolonged
and deadly combat which afterwards ensues. He congratulates the Chancellor upon his scintillating rhetoric, or, if he has not scintillated, he compliments him on the lucidity of his phrasing and the masterly compression of a complicated subject into a speech of reasonable length. The statement to which we have listened this afternoon is, if I may venture to say so, fully worthy not merely of conventional praises of that kind, but of the great reputation of the Chancellor of the Exchequer.
But I want to say something more than that to the right hon. Gentleman to-day. Whatever our differences may be with the Chancellor's politics—they are neither few nor small—he has long since won our admiration for his courage, his sincerity and his eminent Parliamentary gifts. During his illness we have greatly missed him from his place. I wish to say to him in all simplicity to-day that we are truly glad to see him back. We share the gratification which he must have felt that he has been able, thanks largely to his own fortitude of mind, to make his statement to us in person. We observed with satisfaction that there was no diminution in his accustomed powers either of clear statement or of sardonic humour. I do not think anyone could have welcomed him here more heartily than my right hon. Friend the Member for Epping (Mr. Churchill), who would not have missed on any account the opportunity of hearing from the Chancellor's own lips how closely he has now approached him, if not in principle at any rate in practice. We trust that the optimism displayed by the Chancellor is only an indication of his return to health. We earnestly hope that the ordeal through which he has so triumphantly passed this afternoon may leave no evil result behind.
On the contents of the Chancellor's statement I do not propose to dwell. There were in it some things which were not unexpected. There were others, perhaps, which no one had guessed. Some of his proposals we may feel, in the circumstances and within the limitations which the Government have imposed upon themselves, might have been worse. To others, we shall have to offer the sternest opposition. There will be other opportunities for a close and critical examination of the proposals that have
been put before us this afternoon. Now I will conclude by once more congratulating the Chancellor upon his convalescence, and by expressing the hope that he may speedily have a full and complete recovery of his normal health and strength.

Mr. LLOYD GEORGE: I wish to follow the example of the right hon. Gentleman in the very graceful speech with which he has treated the Committee, by simply adding my word of felicitation to the Chancellor upon his return to the House in what appears to be even greater vigour than ever. The gap which was obvious to everyone during his absence is the best proof of the position which he fills in this Parliament, and we are delighted in all parties to see him back apparently in completely restored health. I shall say only one word about the Budget. I felicitate the right hon. Gentleman upon the great feat of courage and endurance which he has exhibited, and, although there are some features of the Budget upon which one may have to comment, certainly not adversely, there is one feature at least which rejoices my heart. I hope that when the right hon. Gentleman comes to deal with it, he will benefit by some of the painful experiences which I had in 1909 and subsequently, and avoid some of those pitfalls. I have no doubt that he will do that. At the moment I simply add my word of felicitation and congratulation to him upon his great feat to-day.

Question put, and agreed to.

INCOME TAX (CHARGE OF TAX).

Resolved,
That—

(a) income tax for the year 1931–1932 shall be charged at the standard rate of four shillings and six pence in the pound, and, in the case of an individual whose total income from all sources exceeds two thousand pounds, at such higher rates in respect of the excess over two thousand pounds as Parliament may hereafter determine;
(b) all such enactments as had effect with respect to the income tax charged for the year 1930–31 shall (subject to such of the provisions contained in the Finance Act, 1930, with respect to income tax as did not take effect with respect to the income tax charged for the year 1930–31) have effect with respect to the income tax charged for the year 1931–32.

And it is hereby declared that it is expedient in the public interest that this Resolution shall have statutory effect under the provisions of the Provisional Collection of Taxes Act, 1913.

HIGHER RATES OF INCOME TAX FOR 1930–31.

Resolved,
That income tax for the year 1930–31 in respect of the excess of the total income of an individual over two thousand pounds shall be charged at rates in the pound which respectively exceed the standard rate for that year by the amounts specified in the second column of the Table contained in section nine of the Finance Act, 1930.
And it is hereby declared that it is expedient in the public interest that this Resolution shall have statutory effect under the provisions of the Provisional Collection of Taxes Act, 1913.

DEDUCTION OF TAX ON DIVIDENDS.

Resolved,
That Rule 20 of the General Rules shall, in relation to a dividend paid by any body of persons, whether before or after the passing of this Resolution, be construed as authorising the deduction of tax from the full amount paid out of profits and gains of the said body which have been charged to tax or which, under the provisions of the Income Tax Acts, would fall to be included in computing the liability of the said body to assessment to tax for any year if the said provisions required the computation to be made by reference to that year and not by reference to any other year or period, and for all the purposes of the Income Tax Acts any such dividend, not being a preference dividend to which Section twelve of the Finance Act, 1930, applies, shall, to the extent to which it is paid out of such profits and gains as aforesaid, but subject to the provisions of Sub-section (3) of the said Section twelve, be deemed to represent income of such an amount as would, after such deduction of tax as is authorised by the said Rule, be equal to the net amount received.
And it is hereby declared that it is expedient in the public interest that this Resolution shall have statutory effect under the provisions of the Provisional Collection of Taxes Act, 1913.

PAYMENT OF INCOME TAX BY INSTALMENTS.

Resolved,
That Sub-section (2) of Section one hundred and fifty-seven of the Income Tax Act, 1918, as amended by Section twenty-one of the Finance Act, 1927, shall be further amended so as to provide that income tax, instead of being paid in two equal instalments, shall, in the cases to which the said sub-section applies, be paid in two instalments of which the first shall be an amount equal to three-quarters of the tax and the second shall be an amount equal to one-quarter of the tax."—[Mr. Snowden.]

AMENDMENT OF LAW.

Motion made and Question proposed,
That it is expedient to amend the law relating to the National Debt, Customs and Inland Revenue (including Excise) and to make further provision in connection with finanoe."—[Mr. Snowden.]
Motion made, and Question, "That the Chairman do report Progress, and ask leave to sit again," put, and agreed to.—[Mr. T. Kennedy.]

Resolutions to be reported To-morrow.

Committee also report Progress; to sit again To-morrow.

The remaining Orders were read, and postponed.

ADJOURNMENT.

Resolved, "That this House do now adjourn."—[Mr. T. Kennedy.]

Adjourned accordingly at Six Minutes after Five o'Clock.